  Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 8:03 am, Sebrioth wrote: | | Unlike TV.Com, tvrage does not revolve about how the most profit could be made, it is a fan based website and those summaries are only used in Promotional Ways, as said before, if a network should ever have a problem with this and contact us about such, they will be immediately removed from TVRage. And furthermore, you might wanna refresh your memory what "Press Releases" are and why networks release them. |
Well, it says press releases are for journalists (although it mentions web sites breiefly, vaguly), and says "Usually the term includes all working journalists and is often used by those who would make generalizations about the product of "most" journalists, for example that journalists who work for large media corporations, or who are based in New York City or Washington, D.C, harbor a liberal (or conservative) bias."
And of course, a web site guy probably wrote the definition... ^o^
It's intellectual property, aint it? So are you saying, "TVRage respects the intellectual property of others, and we ask our users to do the same." or not? If you're saying you can take other people's intellectual stuff because you're a fan-based website, then that statement don't seem to mean much.
Also, there's nothing in that definition above about taking press releases, stitchign them together into an episode guide, putting it on your website, and by absence of attribution saying its yours and yours alone. No "journalist" would do that, on a website or on a newspaper. Self-respecting "journalists" who use a press releae SAY where they got it from.
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 9:17 am |
Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:09 am, Blae wrote: | You may or may not know that your TV.com is doing the exact same thing. For example, their summary for chocolate, or for fair haired child are exact copies of the Showtime versions. A few others are very slightly paraphrased versions of Showtime's summaries.
If they don't mind that a site like TV.com - which sole purpose is to make profit - uses their summaries, I very much doubt they will mind us doing so.
But, agreed, we live in a world where all this legal mumbo-jumbo is an important part of the day to day reality, so I'll take it up with Showtime as soon as I find the right email address to contact them. |
So "Everybody else does it so we can too." Welcome to kindergarten. 
Besides, have you pointed it out to a staff moiderator over there? They might not now about it and do something - you dont know until you try. If you try and they say its OK and tell you to go away, then you've got them.
You've had it pointed out to you, and you're saying as a staff moderator its OK.
| On Friday, January 6th 2006 8:17 am, Blae wrote: | | On Friday, January 6th 2006 7:42 am, Gadfly wrote: | | So...I can take stuff from tvrage and put it on my site? As long as I replace/remove it if I get any complaints, and other sites do it too, its okay? Kewl - I'll start letting everyone know the site mods here say its OK. |
If you are interested in copying some of our text (such as the one on the frontpage) to promote TVrage, please, be our guest! |
Don't know about your frontpage stuff. I migth want to copy some of your site's wrestling stuff from some shows, for my fansite, to make it look better and get more people to my site. I don't care if its someone else's intellectual property (which it is), and I'm sure as heck not gooing to say I got it from somewhere else. It'll help promote wrestling, right? That's all i care about.
| On Friday, January 6th 2006 8:17 am, Blae wrote: | | On Friday, January 6th 2006 7:42 am, Gadfly wrote: | | "Officer, I didn't embezzle that money and cover it up. Of course I would hvae replaced the money if I got any complaints from the bank." |
Heh. You make a funny point, but I think you really know that there's a big difference between a bag of money and a few lines of text. |
Youre not a writer, are you? It's okay to steal as long as it's not too valuable? Again, welcome to kindergarten.
| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:09 am, Blae wrote: | | But, agreed, we live in a world where all this legal mumbo-jumbo is an important part of the day to day reality, so I'll take it up with Showtime as soon as I find the right email address to contact them. |
What about all the other sites that Sebrioth or whoever took some press releases, stitched them together into an episode guide, and put them up without saying whee he got them from and made it look like someone here wrote them? Will you be taking it up with them too? I figure he knows which shows he did this with so he can tell you ez enough.
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 9:20 am |
grailwolf
Level 1 (35%)
Posts: 120
Contrib Points: 1.3
Since: 14/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:09 am, Blae wrote: | | You may or may not know that your TV.com is doing the exact same thing. For example, their summary for chocolate, or for fair haired child are exact copies of the Showtime versions. A few others are very slightly paraphrased versions of Showtime's summaries. |
First of all, I so wish that it was "my" TV.com. Then I could give up the pretense of "working" while I'm actually editing my guides. 
Second, thanks for pointing these out. I'll go see what I can do about them.
| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:09 am, Blae wrote: | | If they don't mind that a site like TV.com - which sole purpose is to make profit - uses their summaries, I very much doubt they will mind us doing so. |
Actually, I'm sure they would mind. And bear in mind that TV.com's stated policy is that posting copyrighted material (or, for that matter, any material from other sites) is strictly forbidden. If such things exist on the site, then it was just allowed because the staff don't have time to search every single official site to make sure that new material is not stolen, so they assumed the poster was following the rules. I've seen several instances of staff removing text from guides (even the main summary) because they were told that it was from another site.
| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:09 am, Blae wrote: | | But, agreed, we live in a world where all this legal mumbo-jumbo is an important part of the day to day reality, so I'll take it up with Showtime as soon as I find the right email address to contact them. |
That was my only point. As I said before, you may be right that they wouldn't mind you using their text, but it's always better to be safe than sorry. At the very least, this way you'll have it in writing in case their lawyers come after you later.
Believe it or not, I wish you only the best with this site. I really think that competition is a good thing for everyone.
As for the email address, you can just go to their site, www.sho.com, and click "contact" on the bottom. Then click the tab labelled "Ask A Question" and use their online form. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 9:48 am |
 Blae
(Site Moderator)
Level 41 (16%)
Posts: 1128
Contrib Points: 17130.7
Since: 26/Oct/05
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I think it is kind of childish to put words into my mouth. I never said "Everybody else does it so we can too". I just pointed out the fact to support my argument that the chance is pretty small that Showtime actually cares.
And no, I haven't reported this to a staff moderator at TV.com. Come on, this isn't Team America: World Police.
Anyways, I've contacted the appropriate people. If they decide to reply, all of you should have a definite answer soon. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 9:52 am |
 PureMaria
Level 26 (52%)
Posts: 3646
Contrib Points: 1536.4
Mood: amused
Since: 20/Nov/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:52 am, Blae wrote: | | I think it is kind of childish to put words into my mouth. I never said "Everybody else does it so we can too". |
I think he/she was being a smartass when they said that. That's why he keeps saying "welcome to kindergarten". |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 9:55 am |
Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:52 am, Blae wrote: | | I think it is kind of childish to put words into my mouth. I never said "Everybody else does it so we can too". I just pointed out the fact to support my argument that the chance is pretty small that Showtime actually cares. |
I didn't say you did. This is what you said, and what I quoted you said.
| On Saturday, November 26th 2005 3:22 am, Blae wrote: | | If you look around, you'll see that a dozen of episode guides / fansites all over the internet are using the networks' official summaries. Most of the times, those summaries are even issued as press releases.. |
Sure sounds like something real similar, though.
| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:52 am, Blae wrote: | | And no, I haven't reported this to a staff moderator at TV.com. Come on, this isn't Team America: World Police. |
So you say (paraphrasing - folks can see your quotes above) it's not a big deal, but if it's a big deal TV.com does it too, but it's not a big deal enough for you to bother actually talking to them and see if they support it or not. And meanwhile you continue to do it despite your policy on copyright and intellectual property. 
You know, you could just delete the stuff, wait until you get permission to turn their press releases into an episode guide, attribute them properly, and actually have some original material for the show. It might not make this site look quit as full, but it'd be a bit more respectful of intellectual property and all. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 10:01 am |
Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:55 am, PureMaria wrote: | | On Friday, January 6th 2006 9:52 am, Blae wrote: | | I think it is kind of childish to put words into my mouth. I never said "Everybody else does it so we can too". |
I think he/she was being a smartass when they said that. That's why he keeps saying "welcome to kindergarten". |
*ding* Yep. Saying essentially "You can see other people do it, so its okay for us" is kindergarten.
Saying essentially "It's okay to steal some words" and implying they're not worth anything (then why steal them?) is something a kndergartener would say too.
If tv.com said this kind of stuff when you point out to one of their staff they've got stolen stuff on their site, they'd be acting kindergarten age too. Guess nobody wants to actually prove that tv.com's okay with it by asking them, though. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 10:04 am |
PureMaria
Level 26 (52%)
Posts: 3646
Contrib Points: 1536.4
Mood: amused
Since: 20/Nov/05
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Why are you here, anyway? If you don't like the site,( not sure if you do or don't) or how things are bein' run here, why don't you just leave? |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 10:14 am |
Blae
(Site Moderator)
Level 41 (16%)
Posts: 1128
Contrib Points: 17130.7
Since: 26/Oct/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 10:01 am, Gadfly wrote: | So you say (paraphrasing - folks can see your quotes above) it's not a big deal, but if it's a big deal TV.com does it too, but it's not a big deal enough for you to bother actually talking to them and see if they support it or not. And meanwhile you continue to do it despite your policy on copyright and intellectual property.
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Well, here we go again. I never said that it was a big deal that TV.com is doing it - I merely pointed out the fact that they do so.
For the rest, I'm starting to wonder if you're just out to annoy me. I can respect grailwolf, but you are just going on and on about this. You already know that we are aware of this and that I'm awaiting a reply from the masters of horror people. If you are not a spokesman for Showtime or IDT Entertainment, may I ask why you care so much? |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 10:17 am |
Me
(Global Editor)
Level 94 (74%)
Posts: 21573
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Mood: To Be Determined
Since: 01/Dec/05
If I go crazy then will you still call me Superman? |
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Isn't there a word that was posted on a thread that needs to be deleted over at TV.com that you should be working on ? Try fixing the bugs over there and work on approving submissions that were added months ago instead of getting in a pissing contest over here about semantics. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 10:25 am |
Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 10:14 am, PureMaria wrote: | | Why are you here, anyway? If you don't like the site,( not sure if you do or don't) or how things are bein' run here, why don't you just leave? |
Whether I like the site or not (like any site, it has its good stuff and its bad), that answers or responds to absolutely none of my questions. I take it you're okay then with a site that puts together press releases, stitches them into an episode guide, then publishes them without saying at least where they cam efrom, making it look like they wrote them?
And what would you say if a TV.com staffer admitted to doing that and that it was okay?
Or are you just a yesman, nodding your head at anything this site does as long as it isn't TV.com
And...aren't you a member of TV.com despite the fac tyou don't like the site or how things are bein' run there? Still posting as of today, it looks like. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 12:05 pm |
PureMaria
Level 26 (52%)
Posts: 3646
Contrib Points: 1536.4
Mood: amused
Since: 20/Nov/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 12:05 pm, Gadfly wrote: | | And...aren't you a member of TV.com despite the fac tyou don't like the site or how things are bein' run there? Still posting as of today, it looks like. |
Yeah? I'm only there until they retire me from my guides, which is taken them forever. Also, I'm guessing you know who I am? Who are you there? I can see if you don't want me to know. Atleast grailwolf used his tv.com ID to state his opinions, why not you? |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 12:18 pm |
Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 10:17 am, Blae wrote: | | For the rest, I'm starting to wonder if you're just out to annoy me. I can respect grailwolf, but you are just going on and on about this. You already know that we are aware of this and that I'm awaiting a reply from the masters of horror people. If you are not a spokesman for Showtime or IDT Entertainment, may I ask why you care so much? |
I'm just responding to you, man, and you're not being very clear sometimes. You tlk about other sites and what they do, but who knows what their copryight stuff is. Why do you have to get a reply from someone to just "respect the intellectual property of others" and put "(from Showtime.com)" or something at the beginning of each entry you got from their site?
Why does someone thinking another site should get noted for contributions to this site annoy u? I like the show, although I only get to watch some of them at my dad's house so i couldn't eidt it because I have nt' seen them all.
I got onto this site because someone I know thought someone here was stealing his stuff from TV.com. He was wrong (and TV.com said so publicly), but i stuck around and check out the occasional thread where this kind of thing comes up, and look in at t the wrestling stuff. And i Just think it's wierd that you guys took stuff from other sites like Sebrioth said and though it was okay but didn't even bother to say where you got them. heck, it makes you guys look bad - I'd think you'd do what you could even if you didn't have to do it, like saying where you got it from if it was a press release. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 12:23 pm |
Gadfly
(Global Editor)
Level 54 (49%)
Posts: 1261
Contrib Points: 39724.3
Since: 13/Dec/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 12:18 pm, PureMaria wrote: | | On Friday, January 6th 2006 12:05 pm, Gadfly wrote: | | And...aren't you a member of TV.com despite the fac tyou don't like the site or how things are bein' run there? Still posting as of today, it looks like. |
Yeah? I'm only there until they retire me from my guides, which is taken them forever. Also, I'm guessing you know who I am? Who are you there? I can see if you don't want me to know. Atleast grailwolf used his tv.com ID to state his opinions, why not you? |
Isn't there a retire button you can click? or does that work for people? And, ummm, before on other stuff you've said here who you are there - I don't have to guess. I know how to look up a profile and see when people posted if that whats' you mean. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 12:26 pm |
Sebrioth
(Site Moderator)
Level 51 (7%)
Posts: 3976
Contrib Points: 11466.2
Mood: Enter Mood
Since: 26/Oct/05
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| On Friday, January 6th 2006 12:05 pm, Gadfly wrote: | | On Friday, January 6th 2006 10:14 am, PureMaria wrote: | | Why are you here, anyway? If you don't like the site,( not sure if you do or don't) or how things are being' run here, why don't you just leave? |
Whether I like the site or not (like any site, it has its good stuff and its bad), that answers or responds to absolutely none of my questions. I take it you're okay then with a site that puts together press releases, stitches them into an episode guide, then publishes them without saying at least where they cam from, making it look like they wrote them?
And what would you say if a TV.com staffer admitted to doing that and that it was okay?
Or are you just a yesman, nodding your head at anything this site does as long as it isn't TV.com
And...aren't you a member of TV.com despite the fac tyou don't like the site or how things are bein' run there? Still posting as of today, it looks like. |
I really wonder, Did you ever even browse through tv.com/old tvtome?
or even looked beyond the forum? it's full of summaries from Press Releases.
And did you even browse through tvrage, or just guessed how it's managed by reading this thread?
A lot the guides here are written by members themselves and in time we are hoping most will be rewritten by members. |
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| Message Posted On Friday, January 6th 2006 At 12:26 pm |
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